Senator (Dr) Ahmadu Ali, a trained surgeon was born on March 1, 1936 at Gbobe near
Lokoja. . He was educated at Nigerian College of Arts and Science, Zaria
between 1955 and 1957 before moving over to University College Hospital (UCH),
Ibadan from 1957 to 1963. He was also at the University of Edinburgh, Scotland
and the Royal College of Physicians, Edinburgh.
At one time, he was a Minister of Education, he is the first Director General
of the National Youth Service Corps, NYSC, he was a senator for three times,
he was a National Chairman of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP), he is the
Chancellor African Business School. Presently, he is the Chairman Petroleum
Products Pricing Agency, PPPRA. Senator Ahmadu Ali is a distinguished
statesman who has served this country well. In this interview,
Senator Ali spoke to a team of editors. Excerpts:
You graduated as a medical doctor from the University
College Hospital, Ibadan in 1963, and then, you went on to enlist into the
Nigerian Army. Firstly, what attracted you to study medicine and why did you
enlisted into the army as a doctor?
Right from my secondary school days at Barewa College, Zaria, and the flagship
profession of students of Barewa College was the military. That is why the
first, the second and the third generations of Nigerian army officers were all
from Barewa College. The attraction was that right from secondary school class
one to three, you only did two lessons. The rest, you went to the army barracks
and train with recruits on how to shot, how to take cover and how to blow up
bridges and so on. So, we were atuned towards the military. I actually wanted
to join the Air force, because the Vice Principal of Barewa College, who was a
mathematician was an ex pilot during the Second World War. Eventually, they now
enlisted us into British air force and sent letters to our D O’s and so on and
they interviewed our parents and my mother being the only living parent
rejected my joining the air force. That suppressed my ambition for the air
force. My study of medicine came, because when I completed my secondary
school, my result that year was the best in the whole of Barewa College.
Another Igala boy, Momoh Sule from Ankpa had the best result ever before
me. One day, the late Northern Premier came to our school and promised
that no body from our class of 1954 would be employed by the Northern regional
government. He said that we should all go to the Nigerian College of Arts,
Science and Technology which was starting at that time. Those to be employed
were those who failed their school certificate examinations. In making a choice
of wat to study, I remembered that my late father was ill and refused to take
western medicine and I said to myself, well, I would rather study
medicine. So I went through the Nigeria College, did advance level London
and gained automatic admission to Ibadan to study medicine. In my final year at
Ibadan in 1963, there was an advert for recruitment of young people,
especially, university graduates into the army. So three of us that were
friends, Professor Humphrey Anyawu, late Brigadier General Adelaja and I
decided to apply. After the interview, we were taken and commissioned as second
Lieutenant on March 14 1963. My final exam at UCH was in October. So I joined
the army without a degree actually. What that means is that I graduated from
the university as a soldier, because I was already a second Lieutenant. So you
can see that it was this old ambition that I now give expression to it again.
What
actually led to the ‘Ali Must Go demonstration in 1978 when you were Minister
of Education’?
Demonstrations by undergraduates in Nigerian Universities are not new. After
the one of 1978, about three ministers who came after me also suffered the same
fate. Students carried placards and insisted that they must go. ABU students
carried placards against Professor Ango Abdullahi…they said that Ango Must Go.
In my own case, I was not part to anything that led to Ali Must Go
demostrations. As Minister for Education, I fought for money for education. The
money meant for the universities, the treasury handed it over to the National
Universities Commission. I recreated the National Universities Commission
during my time, just as I produced the Joint Admission and Matriculation Board,
JAMB. I brought in Doctor Angulu who was the Register of ABU to come and be its
pioneer Register. Professor Jubril Aminu was lecturing at the Ibadan Teaching
Hospital; I also nominated him to become the Register of NUC. Government’s
revenue at that time was dwindling due to sharp fall in oil revenue. So one of
the measures they took to beef up income was by asking students to pay for the
food they eat. I think then, they were already paying twenty five kobo and it
was going to be fifty kobo per meal. This was unacceptable to them. But this
decision was not taken by the ministry. It was the NUC that took that decision.
The NUC did not route that decision through the ministry. They went through
General Yar Adua who was then Chief of Staff to Obasanjo and it landed at the
Supreme Council which is superior to the Federal Executive Council were I
belonged. So the they took that decision and we heard it on radio. So myself
and the Permanent Secretary wrote a letter of warning to Professor Jubril Aminu
who was the Executive Secretary of the NUC at that time, that they had no right
to do a thing like that and that they should pass through the ministry. Well,
that was what led to all the meetings that culminated into that demonstration.
Before then, I got on well with them as a onetime Secretary General of the
National Union of Nigerian Students. I tried to reach out to them. I even flew
to Maiduguri to talk to them. It was after the secret meeting they held in
Calabar that the whole thing erupted.
You
were said to have always held independent views, even from that of the Head of
State when you were Minister for Education, especially at Federal Executive
Council Meetings. How true is this?
I don’t know about holding independent views. What you saying is that all
through my life, I speak my mind. I do not play politics with people’s lives.
When discussion are on, what I feel, I say it. I know a Head of State who used
to throw his files at me. I collect it and then take it back to him. They know
me as someone who would always speak out his mind. That is why General Gowan
appointed me a minister on 24th of January 1975. They overthrew him in July of
that same year; Murtala came in as Head of State. Murtala and I never agreed,
we were always at each other’s throat. He was my junior in Barewa College.
Immediately he came in as Head of State, he said he will not have any body in
education, except me. When Obasanjo became Head of State after Murtala’s death,
he insisted that I should continue to be Minister of Education, even when
people like General Danjuma wanted me to go back to medical because that area
was suffering as a result of my political appointment. Obasanjo insisted I
remain in education.
Considering
the vision of the of founders of National Youth Service Corps of
which you were the pioneer Director General, would you say that the scheme is
living up to its objectives or has it outlived its usefulness?
Only short sighted people in our society would say that the NYSC has outlived
its usefulness. As far I am concerned, it can never outlive its usefulness. In
a society of almost three hundred tribal groups, there is nothing you need more
than understanding of one another. That is the key to living together. The
scheme helps young people to learn how to live with other people. It helps them
appreciate other people. A child from Ogun state goes to serve in Borno,
Calabar goes to serve in Sokoto and so on. This will foster unity. That is why
we believe that NYSC can never outlive its usefulness. Apart from the
great understanding it forges, inter marriages happen. By accident, these are
the most useful people that can make election credible in Nigeria, at least,
for the time being.
The Igala/Bassa people of Kogi east elected you into the Senate three times,
making you the first Nigerian to be so honoured. What was responsible for this
and what have you given back to them in return?
I keep giving back even when I am no longer a Senator. I keep serving Kogi East
and the whole of Nigeria in every capacity I find myself. The creation of Kogi
State was under my Chairmanship for eleven years. I was the leader of the
movement for the creation of Kogi State. I travelled to America and everywhere
to see that I could make use of all the levers to create Kogi State. The Igalas
made a big mistake when they left Kwara for Benue. I was in government and I
had succeeded in convincing the Federal Executive Council that the Igalas
should be left to remain in Kwara until such time when states will be created
on provincial basis, then, we will have a Kabba province state. That was my
position. But some of our boys went and lobbied at the Supreme Military Council,
and some emirs and chiefs also lobbied powerful people that they will never
belong to a state with the people who are now in that state. So they had to
remove them from that province and used the Igalas just to fill the gap. Within
a year, those who criticized my position in the Federal Executive Council for
wanting Igalas to remain in Kwara summoned me and they were begging me to take
a letter to Obasanjo to return them back. So I told them that I was not
Obasanjo’s Chief of Protocol, so why should I carry the letter, that they
should post the letter. When I told General Obasanjo that this is what my
people are saying, Obasanjo said,”but I told you.” Because Obasanjo had told me
earlier that my people had gone to lobby some emirs and that they will go to
Benue and suffer. Eventually, It was the Attah of Igala that told me that
I have been elected to lead the movement for the creation of Kogi state when
the agitation started. My wife, I think must be the first woman to stand on the
drum to campaign for the creation of Kogi state. She also made donations
ofcourse. General Babangida who created the state, went to the United Nations
to speak at the UN as Head of State, so I flew there with my wife. We were in
the United Nations floor, in the Ministerial kiosk, because I had told
Ambassador Gambari who was Nigeria’s Representative at the UN to reserve a
place for me. He booked accommodation and a seat. After Babangida’s speech, we
all went to World of Astoria in the evening for cocktail. When Babangida saw me
he said, ‘Likita, you came all the way. You are not a business man. It is
business men that follow Heads of States around. What have you come to do”? I
said well, I came to give you support. So the Inspector General of Police,
Gambo Jimeta said to Babangida, ‘So you don’t know why he is here? He is
looking for the creation of Kogi State that is why he is following you about.”
So Babangida said ”wallahi, by the grace of God I will create Kogi State for
you.” So that is the secret.
When you aspired to become the governor of Kogi state
under the platform of NRC, lots of your admirers were excited at the prospect
of having you as their governor. What truncated your ambition?
I did not succeed in standing for any primary election. After the creation of
the state in 1991, everybody said, well you brought the state, so come and be
our governor. My old teacher, Alhaji Abdulrahaman Okene summoned me and told me
to take a shot at it since the elders have decided. So I was preparing myself
for primaries when Babangida made a law banning any Chairman of any committee
of the National Assembly or State Assemblies from standing for elections. So,
that cancelled me out.
As
national Chairman of PDP, what were your achievements?
What would be the achievement of a National Chairman of a party more than how
well you ran the party? We instilled discipline into the party and put it back
in its frontline position. We made it a party that you can reckon with at all
angles. We went to the general elections and captured twenty eight states out
of thirty six; I transited the federal government from civilian to civilian
without any hitch in 2007. You must remember that my
predecessors in office were sacked because they fiddled with the finances of
the party. Before I left office, I gave one billion naira for the building of a
permanent secnetariat of the PDP. I then created a committee that will handle
the project under Goodluck Jonathan, the Vice President, who later turned out
to be our President. This committee had to go round raising funds so that when
I leave office the project would go on. I even got the C of O of the land for
them. At our secretariat, we owed fourty five million when I got there, I paid
off the debt and it became our own. I met no Kobo when I came, so I was carrying
bowl in hand to be able to pay staff. After the nomination for the election,
the party came into plenty of money. I didn’t believe that my predecessors
stole any more initially….but I eventually realized that there was money. Ten
people will pay the party to buy forms for one post…. Over to billion naira
came in as result of that process. When I realized this, I was shocked. One day
I called the Director of Finance and asked whether all the money people are
paying for forms across the country was going into a particular account. He
said yes sir. He brought the statement and there was N1.5 billion in Zenith
Bank, half a billion with Standard Chartered or so. I told myself that this
money will not disappear like the last one. So I decided to do something
reasonable with the funds.
What
is your appraisal of the Goodluck Jonathan administration, especially,
considering the high rate of unemployment, dwindling economy and high level of
insecurity in the country?
The administration of Goodluck Jonathan is battling with a lot of problems.
That is not unheard of in other administrations. Boko Haram was there before
Jonathan came. Before then there was MEND and these Niger Delta Militants
blowing up oil installations, kidnapping people and asking for ransom. All
these have been going on. But the magnitudes seem to have exploded in recent
times. But we have to ask ourselves; if fire for fire does not solve the problem,
perhaps jaw to jaw will. But President Jonathan is trying his best. We
have to give him a chance before we can make a honest and critical assessment.
